Megan's Discussion Questions Oct. 11/12
Please read as much of John A. Moretta's William Penn and the Quaker Legacy as you can before Thursday. William Penn played an important role in shaping the future of the United States. What exactly was the legacy of Penn and the Quakers? What were Penn’s strengths and weaknesses as a leader? Why is Penn often times forgotten when “founding fathers” are discussed? Remember to back up your discussion with evidence from the text.
posted by Megan Boccardi at 9:23 PM
26 Comments:
William Penn established a colony which allowed religious and political outsiders from England to settle. Penn created a democratic constitution for his colony, which guaranteed free and fair trial by jury, freedom of religion, freedom from unjust imprisonment and free elections. This colony was advertised all over Europe, and many immigrated there bringing many new cultural aspects that the colonies had yet to see. Penn’s strengths as a leader were to bring many different people together from all over Europe to inhabit his colony. He also saw the future of the colonies joined as one nation. Penn’s main weakness was that he never broke out of debt even though his colony was successful and growing steadily.
Penn's Pennsylvania was the predecessor to the United States. It was a large colony where Christian Europeans could immigrate to enjoy more liberties. He welcomed all Christians to his colony, or his "Holy Experiment." Penn ran his colony efficiently, like a true leader. He created a constitutional document for it and improvised it until it better suited the colony and its people. Penn established the foundation for Democracy in America. Perhaps his weakness as a leader (which could also be considered a strength) was his own indecisiveness. This indecisiveness could be seen as being open minded, but he was accepting of independence or the continued colonization of America. Penn made some major contributions to Pre-Independence America, mainly the establishment of democracy among the colonies.
Doug Smith,
William Penn sort of started to lay the foundation stones for our county to build on. His Pennsylvania was one where many different types of people could come and live and his ideas about government and creating a constitution were ahead of his time. I belive that he is sometimes forgotten when talking about founding fathers because he was doing this so long before the revolutionary war and all the people we associate with "founding fathers" like George Washington and Thomas Jefferson.
In one word the Quaker’s legacy could be defined as hospitable. This could be said because they often expressed selflessness towards others. An example of this is when Penn was offered a place to stay by a complete stranger just so that he would not miss a Quaker meeting. Quaker’s were very dedicated to their beliefs due to the fact that they would sit in a room together for hours waiting for someone to receive words that the spirit inspired. They lived strict lives since they could not drink alcohol and wore very conservative clothing. Since they were hated by almost all of the other religions they were often punished and beaten. The Quakers legacy is that they lived their lives according to their religious beliefs unlike most religions.
Penn obviously had many strengths, such as, intelligence, religion, and the strength of pursuing his dreams and goals. William Penn believed he could bring about God’s kingdom on earth. He wanted to share his religion, and knowledge thereof with whoever was interested in believing in what he was preaching. As it says in the book, Penn did not discriminate against faith, shade of skin, or place of origin (Moretta pp. xvi). Another strength of William Penn, responsibility, is also his greatest weakness. Penn was the individual most responsible of founding the society in Pennsylvania that foreshadowed the religious and ethnic pluralism of the future United States (Moretta pp. xi). Penn’s greatest weakness was his responsibility towards his colony and his absence from his colony for fifteen years. He lacked responsibility towards his colony when he decided to return to England only two years after acquiring his charter. The book states that at the beginning of his holy experiment he was a much-loved proprietor, Penn contributed to his vision’s demise, as well as to the incessant rancor and turbulence that affected his colony by not remaining long in Pennsylvania. Penn’s prolonged absence from Pennsylvania caused him to lose touch with his province, and when he returned in 1699, it was too late. Therefore, he faced a hardened and hostile antiproprietary combination of both Quakers and non-Quakers determined to wrest from him what little authority he had left after a fifteen-year withdrawal (Moretta pp. xiii).I believed if William Penn truly wanted to achieve his goal of bringing about God’s kingdom on earth, then he wouldn’t have left his new charter. I don’t understand how he could lead his colony while he was in England. It is kind of ironic how Penn wanted spread Quakerism to many people, but couldn’t stay to take responsibility of his colony.
Penn was a bit of a pioneer in his ideas founding Pennsylvania. With a formal democratic constitution in writing, Pennsylvania trailblazed a path for our future government of today. Penn clearly wanted to share his Christian views but by no means inforced them. This idea especially closely relates to politicians of today.
The legacy of Penn and the Quakers is establishing a present-day American society. The Quakers were first to resent and reject the “Crown”. Penn, in my opinion, had the qualities to become a great leader, but much like his father, he was self-absorbed and could not see what was best for those around him. He was a strong-willed leader in the sense he was relentless and strong in his faith. He lacked as a leader because he expected everyone to see and do things as he himself did. Penn is forgotten as a founding father because he technically did not live in America. He remotely controlled his colony. This was party not his fault though because he had fear of going back to Pennsylvania because he was labeled as Jacobite, and if he went back then it would appear he was running. He would have been a greater founding father had he the ability and will to live and control his colony in person.
William Penn was a very influential leader of the Quakers, who shaped the Pennsylvania colony and the United States as we know it today. He based his foundation and ideas off of the beliefs of democracy and religious freedoms. Penn was determined to create this god inspired society, so that it could grow and spread into the areas of our present day America.
William Penn set up a colony, which permitted Christian outsiders from England to settle and enjoy some freedom. Penn created a democracy for his colony, which promoted freedom of religion, freedom from unjust imprisonment and free elections. This colony became very popular and many people started to immigrate to this colony and bring different cultures and practices. Penn had lots of strength’s but his main strength was his ability to bring different people from all over and have them get along with each other. Penn’s greatest weakness was his lack of responsibility to his colony, he left for 15 years and people say that he is responsible for the troubles that his colony endured.
The legacy of William Penn and the Quakers was one of religion and temptation. William Penn envisioned America, mainly Pennsylvania, as a place for religious freedom and a chance for a new life for the Quakers. This turned into a land of temptation. Everything that the quiet, subdued Quakers were denied in England and by their previous Puritan governors they found in excess in Pennsylvania. William Penn wanted Pennsylvania to be a �Religious experiment�, according to the text. However it failed as the Quakers fell into the temptations of the new world and became self-pleasing persons, putting themselves first and the church second.
William Penn greatly influenced the quakers. William lived in England, but got a charter for an American colony. This American colony would be called Pennsylvania after Penn's father.This colony would have many new rights that were unheard of by some. He believed that england would never get religious freedom, and wanted to start a colony that supported a variety of religions. Penn had some unpopular beliefs such as woman rights, freedom of religion, and anti-slavery beliefs. These beliefs would eventually lay the foundation for the United States of America.
William Penn believed that he could settle a new colony that would be greatly different from that of England. He brought about new rights and religious freedom to the Americas. He wanted to settle a land free of unwanted hatred and people afraid to talk about religion. He is overlooked as a founding father because i believe his beliefs became forgotten and the Quakers became like all the others. His anti-slavery beliefs brought up dought and it seemed like once people got to A,erica they did not want to be different. Eventually the Quakers settled themselves and America grew from some of the beliefs that Penn brought to the "free land." This is Kyle Whitehead and the blogger name will not work.
The Quakers were seen as a very accepting, peaceful religious group, that were not welcomed in many other countries. When Penn became a Quaker and then recieved the grant for land in North America he created a place that welcomed the Quaker faith and religious freedom. His colony was also created for profit, although he failed in that as he was truly never out of debt. It seems Penn is forgotten when mentioning the founding fathers probably because he did practically fail at creating a prosperous colony, and his colony was based mainly on religious freedom while others were not. Also, Penn's beliefs helped to found the beliefs of America, though they were not all accepted at the time, which may have also caused him to be outcast from some other founding fathers.
After the establishment of the Pennsylvania colony, William Penn found it necessary to make the colony free to practice any religion. This was intentionally an act to allow Christians to practice freely,but he also tried to turn it into a way of making capital. Penn was never viewed as a strong leader because he was very passive in the way he lead, however, his peaceful mentality was what helped to shape the US. Though it was an unpopular idea at the time, Penn's practice of free religion is that of which we live by today. He is never mentioned as a founding father because he really didn't help to build the body of government they had back then.
~Griffin Foley
William Penn became the head-figure of the Quaker religion after becoming friends with its creator, George Fox. His democratic constitution for the Quaker territory, the Pennsylvania Frames of Government, was used as a guide when the United States Constitution was created. The Quakers beliefs were to remain peaceful, they refused to take up arms, never bowed or took off their hats to another man, and denied swearing oaths of any kind. They were a prosperous community because few argued and personal relations were good.
The Quakers, with William Penn as their guide, played a major role in shaping American society. They helped establish many of the American ideals that we hold dear today, such as the belief in fundamental human rights. This springs largely from their original doctrine, which rejected the notion of predestination, and said that everyone has an Inner Light, which can be accessed, by having a personal relationship with God. They believed that everyone (men and women, people of all races) had this Inner Light, hence everyone was equal. America is a nation founded on that principal; “all men are created equal…” Although this may have been just a written principal, and not practiced for many years, it is one of the main ideals that defines our great nation. The Quakers also helped develop a nation that guaranteed freedom of speech, freedom from religious persecution. Since Quakers faced extreme animosity in England (they were arrested and punished without reason, just because they were Quakers) it is only natural that they would set up a place that allowed people to worship however they pleased without fear of retribution. Quakers in essence lay the roots for the American Revolution. They were the first rebels, rejecting social norms, such as deference, carrying arms, and taking oaths of allegiance. About a hundred years later, Americans would ban together and reject England as their Lord. They would rise above the only thing they knew and create an entirely new nation.
Although he was a very conflicted individual, William Penn pioneered these Quaker efforts in Pennsylvania. Unlike many of his contemporaries, Penn established relationships with the Native Americans, “whom he believed were no less human, no less endowed with the Inner Light than white Europeans.” He treated them, for instance, in his land dealings, as equals. Unfortunately, in the end, Penn’s “holy experiment” did not turn out as well as he hoped. This may be one of the reason’s why he is not considered one of America’s great founding fathers, because although he laid much of the groundwork for America’s founding, he viewed his project as a failure. The Quaker’s in Penn’s colony did not rise to his high expectations, and he became angry and frustrated. The common people were too overwhelmed by the possibilities that were available to them that they ignored the government that Penn was trying to establish. This great thinker may have come a little too much before his time.
I believe that William Penn is often forgot about when talking about the "Founding Fathers" because he was about 75-100 years ahead when the constitution and the United States came about. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, Alexander Hamilton, James Madison & others were the key figures that wrote up the Declaration of Independence and the Constituion. Since William Penn was not capable of contributing to these 2 things, he if forgotten. It's too bad that he is not talked about as much because he contributed alot to our country. He was the founder of Pennsylvania and was major part in the Quakers, who believed that God was within everyone and spoke directly to them. Also, the democratic principles that he set forth in the Pennsylvania frames of government, served as an inspiration for the constitution.
Penn is arguably considered one of the most important figures in history of all time. Penn was ahead of his time with his actions. He was one of the founding fathers and the only one to create a democratic constitution single handedly. This served as inspiration for the actual declaration of independence. He was also the founder of Pennsylvania. Penn lead the Quakers; they became a culture of conciliation. Being a Quaker got him into a lot of trouble, because it was not accepted by the new world. Penn tried to make life fair for everyone, because his religion was looked down upon. When creating Pennsylvania he added rules that made it so that any religion was ok.Penn considered all humans equal. Penn offered a new outlook on community as well, incorporating different aspects to make life better for all.
er Legacy as you can before Thursday. William Penn played an important role in shaping the future of the United States. What exactly was the legacy of Penn and the Quakers? What were Penn’s strengths and weaknesses as a leader? Why is Penn often times forgotten when “founding fathers” are discussed? Remember to back up your discussion with evidence from the text.
The legacy of the quakers was pretty much that they did not believe in predestination, clergy, or any heirarchal type of chain within religion. The quakers believed that everyone had an 'inner light" and it just needed to be found. The Quakers thought that every religion should be accepted within the government and that they should be able to meet anywhere they please. In the moretta book Penn and his fellow Quakers are constantly being thrown in jail for meeting on the street or for starting "holy conversations" with people to get them to see their inner light.
When Penn finaly was given Pennsylvania in the New World, he faced many problems. The quitrents started out working well, but then the Quakers became frustrated with Penn, so they quit paying him the quitrents. One of the major problems that Penn had was that he did not spend enough time in the NEw World. HE would fear losing his proprietership and sail back to England. HE then would spend YEARS there and did not realize that he needed to be present to successfully govern his land in the New World.
Something Penn was good at though was convincing people of power to tolerate all religions. He finally struck gold with Anne (towards the end of his life) by convincing her to give complete freedom to Quakers and for them to have just as many rights. He was very charismatic, and had many "connections" within the Royalty.
All together Penn was the most successful proprieter and accomplished the msot with Pennsylvania. Moretta often points out Penn's flaws and not many of his good characteristics so it was sort of hard to pick out certain dominant ones.
The legacy of William Penn is a leader that allowed for religious freedom and he also created a democratic government in Pennsylvania because he wanted to be different from England. He tried to change religious freedom in England but when he was arrested for being a Quacker he decided to go to America and make a place for religious freedom. They were unlike any town before them they allowed every type of person and were a very peaceful town.Penn's strengths included new thinking on government and religious freedom. He was way ahead of his time on democracy no other government was like this before. His Constitution he made is used as a frame for the current U.S .Constitution. His weakness is that he was a pacifist Quaker yet he was a proponent of violence more than any other Quaker. He is often forgotten as a founding father because he was way to far ahead of his time. If he was around later he would probably be more recognized.
William Penn played an important role as the leader of the Quakers in New England, but also helped shape many of the American ideals of what is common today. Penn led the Quakers who were the most radical and controversial of the Protestants. Their religion was hated by many, but William Penn created a place for them by finding Pennsylvania. Even though their practices were so ‘radical’ at the time, it has led too much of the origins of modern American society. The Quakers believed every person had an “inner light” that could reveal God’s truth to them. They believed clergy was not needed for a successful religion. The Quaker religion also allowed women to preach which was extremely radical and went against the patriarchal ways of European society. They also treated everyone as equals. This is probably one of the most important things in Quaker society. No one was above anyone else on the social ladder and thus emphasized equal rights. William Penn helped lead these Quakers to the success they found in New England. However, he often is forgotten when mentioning the founding fathers because he was not around during the writing of the Constitution. Many of these Constitution writers are considered America’s founding fathers.
The legacy of William Penn and the Quakers plays an important role in American Society, even today. The Quakers were a radical religious group who believed many controversial issues such as not removing their hat for higher authority and silent church "meetings." They believed that everyone had an "inner light" which would reveal God's truth to the believers. Because of their beliefs, the Quakers were not welcome in many countries and eventually came to American to practiced their religion.
William Penn was a leader of the Quakers and was considered a good leader because of his submissive ways of ruling. He is not normally mentioned when there is talk of the "founding fathers" of American because he did not actually live in American for many years. His absense in people's minds during these times made him easy to forget when the founding fathers were being talked about. Hence, he is not veiwed as a "founding father" of America.
-Kristin Robben
William Penn was one of the most influential "Founding Fathers" even though that may not be popular belief. When he founded Pennsylvania he created a reffuge where the Quakers could be free from persecution and everyone was equal, it didnt matter what your religious beliefs were or how different your culture.
Penn was a great leader for many reasons, but one reason stands out the most; He had unbelievable determination. Even after he was expelled from Oxford, and all the persecution for the Quakers radical beliefs he had to face, he kept on with his beliefs.
Even though Penn set the foundation and was the inspiration for many things to come for the United States of America, he did all those things well before the other, more popular, Founding Fathers did what they did to earn the title of "Founding Father".
William Penn's Pennsylvania was the cornerstone that American democracy was founded on. He created a colony open to all people of many different morals and beliefs that could be self run. This new colony offered things like freedom of religion, and the right to a fair trial be jury. This attracted many people from all over Europe to come to America and try Penn's Pennsylvania. Penn's strength was the availability of true freedom to so many people who had never lived this way before, but at the same time his weakness directly correlated with this attribute. He brought all fo these new people to his colonie and then left them with no guidence. I think that William Penn is so often forgotten when discussing the founding fathers because he started the job but did not finish it. Great men like George Washington and Abraham Licoln led their people to the end.
William Penn was instrumental in developing a place for people to be free other than previously established settlement based off of English values. He was in debt during the building of his colony, and fell off history's charts because of he didn't live in America. His innovations laid foundation for states later on in American colonization.
william penn was a pioneer in the way of creating a governemnt were everybody had a voice. when william penn created pennsylvania he wanted a place were everybody could come, especially his quakers and practice their own religion without persecution from other religious or political beliefs. when penn wrote his famous "frame of government" constitution, he established things like freedom of religion, trial by jury, rotation of offices, and things like an education system and a penal code. everyone in pennsylavania had equal rights indians and african americans were loooked at as equals they were even given trial by jury were they would be judged by six of there peers along with six settlers and women were aloud to vote which was as far as i know never aloud before. william penn created a place were everybody could come and live freely and equally. later when the founding fathers are trying to write the constitution they would look at penn's work and use it as a basis for the foundation of america
nicholas wood
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